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Sunday, November 6, 2011

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: CS506 assignment 2 solution

dear ap vu conten libraby main ja k download karo

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 11:44 PM, mc100401703 Fouzia Tabassum <mc100401703@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

plz koi btaye ga k cs506 ka jo software install karna he wo cs506 k downloads m kis name se he?

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 2:51 PM, Anila Rasheed <mc100404710@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

i want tooooooooooooooo

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 2:14 AM, <babar.cgs@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear All,

if anyone in the riyadh I want combine study. Please contact me. My skype id is babar.alli

regards

babar

From: Tanweer Ahmed

Sent: Friday, November 04, 2011 10:44 PM

To: vustudymania@googlegroups.com ; vu-and-company@googlegroups.com ; vu-mcs-bright@googlegroups.com ; vu-study-corner@googlegroups.com ; vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com ; vumasters@googlegroups.com ; vustudymasti@googlegroups.com ; vuzs@googlegroups.com ; vu-pink@googlegroups.com ; vu-rose@googlegroups.com ; virtualiansnet@googlegroups.com ; pak-youth@googlegroups.com ; pakistani_students1947@googlegroups.com ; star-friends-group@googlegroups.com ; love_peace@googlegroups.com

Subject: ::: vuaskari.com ::: CS506 assignment 2 solution

Last Date of submit is 15th November.

--
Regards
Tanweer Ahmed
MCS 3rd Semester CS502, CS504, CS506, CS610, CS614
and CS619 (Statistical Analyzer for Data Manipulation)

--
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HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
MIT 3rd semester
subjects
CS502 - Fundamentals of Algorithms
CS506 - Web Design and Development
CS614 - Data Warehousing
CS615 - Software Project Management
CS619 - Final Project - CS619{{ statistical analyzer for data manipulation}}
MGT602 - Entrepreneurship

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
MIT 3rd semester
subjects
CS502 - Fundamentals of Algorithms
CS506 - Web Design and Development
CS614 - Data Warehousing
CS615 - Software Project Management
CS619 - Final Project - CS619{{ statistical analyzer for data manipulation}}
MGT602 - Entrepreneurship

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

RE: ::: vuaskari.com ::: MTH302 - Business Mathematics & Statistics.....

Hello Kashif,

I have same answer for Question 3. I think it is correct J

Thanks & Regards

Waqar Naeem

VAS Front Office, Team Leader

MBA Executive, 1^st Semester

Saudi Telecom Company, KSA

From: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com [mailto:vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mc110401792 Muhammad Asif
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2011 11:38 PM
To: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: MTH302 - Business Mathematics & Statistics.....

my answer is 1826.96

On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 6:29 PM, mc110401257 Syed Mustafa <mc110401257@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

W/slam I am student of MIT deficiency semester. If you have done MTH 302 Assignment.1 then plz just verify the answer. I have solved the question but I am not sure my answer is correct or not specially Answer of Q.3. My answer is 83,240.49. Is it correct or not? plz reply.

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 10:12 PM, mc110401738 Israr Ahmad Khan <mc110401738@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

A.O.A
ap Kia kar rahi hain? MBA or MCS or any other program

& what's ur subjects?

I m student of MBA 1st semester... If u r also the same then i invite u 4 combine study. I will send u ur required assignment. No woorryy... tension nahi leny ka...

Allah Hafiz
Israr AHmad Khan
Islamabad

On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 12:01 PM, mc110403828 Arooj Zameer Ghouri <mc110403828@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Dear Friends,

If anyone is Done With MTH302 - Business Mathematics & Statistics kindly verify Anwer of FV(Future Value) in Question # 2
--

Regards,
Arooj Ghouri
MBA Executive

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
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HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

RE: ::: vuaskari.com ::: MBA Exective Students

ACC501 is finance, not accounting.

Please check the definition of both finance and accounting.

Thanks & Regards

Waqar Naeem

VAS Front Office, Team Leader

MBA Executive, 1^st Semester

Saudi Telecom Company, KSA

From: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com [mailto:vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mc110403828 Arooj Zameer Ghouri
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2011 7:58 PM
To: Group
Subject: ::: vuaskari.com ::: MBA Exective Students

Anyone can help me solving Quiz of ACC501........... Accounts mayre uper se guzar jati hay........ :-(

I think i should arrange a tutor for it:-(

Regards,

Arooj Ghouri

MBA Executive

RE: ::: vuaskari.com ::: Books Soft Copy

Thanks brother but these are handouts. I am talking about the recommended books.

Thanks & Regards

Waqar Naeem

VAS Front Office, Team Leader

MBA Executive, 1^st Semester

Saudi Telecom Company, KSA

From: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com [mailto:vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Haroon Rasheed
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2011 12:10 PM
To: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: Books Soft Copy

Dear All,
The soft copy of each subject is available in course website of each subject.
You can download it from the download section of course website.

--
Haroon Ur Rasheed
MBA(MIS)
Virtual University of Pakistan

On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 9:57 AM, Waqar Naeem <mc110400024@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Dears,

If anyone gets access to soft copies, please share. I have been in search for long.

Thanks & Regards

Waqar Naeem

VAS Front Office, Team Leader

MBA Executive, 1^st Semester

Saudi Telecom Company, KSA

From: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com [mailto:vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mc110403365 Sadia Naureen
Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 10:19 AM
To: vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Subject: ::: vuaskari.com ::: Books Soft Copy

Dear All,

Kindly send the soft copy of books recommend by vu teachers of CS101, MGT211, MGT301, MGT101, MGT503.

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: fee

It's ok. This mean for the overseas student for one semester fee is around 555 US Dollar ??

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 9:44 PM, mc100200525 Waseem Hassan Gul <mc100200525@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Dears,

I got 3.93 GPA in semester 3, Still I didn't get any scholarship. My LMS shows fee of 5 subjects.

Please guide

Salam

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 9:53 PM, Admin Binish <greyferry@gmail.com> wrote:
dear virtual university charges the fee per sbjects and per hrzs
so they had just charged u enrollement fee+one sbject fee in the first voucher
now this is final and last voucher
u can make installment of this to 3 or 5 or u can pay it in one voucher form

thanks
g_luck

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:48 PM, mc110200336 Raja Khurram Shahzad <mc110200336@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Hi All,

Please your guidance , i am confused how many times i have to pay the fee, Before VU announced and i paid it . Now again after one month they upload a new fee voucher .
How many times we have to pay the fee and this fee will be for how long duration ??

Waiting for your reply .

Regards

Raja

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--










--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: study group

i am from Shahkot

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: study group

i am also ready......

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: CS506 assignment 2 solution

Hi,
can you send it's Test.java file

On 4 November 2011 20:44, Tanweer Ahmed <mcsvuedupk@gmail.com> wrote:

Last Date of submit is 15th November.

--
Regards
Tanweer Ahmed
MCS 3rd Semester CS502, CS504, CS506, CS610, CS614
and CS619 (Statistical Analyzer for Data Manipulation)

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--------------------------------------

Best Regards

Ata-Ul-Nasar

BS Software Engineering

Linnaeus University Sweden

-----------------------------------------

::: vuaskari.com ::: plz koi mujhy ye bataiy ga k ye theek hy ya nahi

2568783	PFSD01	2700	0	2700	0	-2700	UnPaid	Print	Upload Paid Voucher
2568784	PFSD01	2700	0	2700	0	-5400	UnPaid	Print	Upload Paid Voucher
2568785	PFSD01	2700	0	2700	0	-8100	UnPaid	Print	Upload Paid Voucher
2568786	PFSD01	2700	0	2700	0	-10800	UnPaid	Print	Upload Paid Voucher
2568787	PFSD01	2700	0	2700	0	-13500	UnPaid	Print	Upload Paid Voucher
						Net Balance	-13500

mean main pochna ye chehti hon k mera net balance to 13500 ka hy

likn meri instalment aisy keun hoi hy

wo bhi itni zyada

plz jaldi batain

or is ka hall bhi

kia 1 bar jo instal ment ho jaiy to dobara rechange nahi ker sakty kia hum us koo

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: لپ ٹاپ براۓفروخت Laptop For Urgent Sale, Rs.22500, Don't miss it!

PP09S, Dell LATITUDE D430

2011/11/6 TAHIR Zaman <tahirzamansulehri@gmail.com>

please me the Model number of Lap Top
regards
tahir

On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 12:06 AM, mc090400043 Noman Shahid <mc090400043@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Nothing is local the Socket shoe is local but charger including power cable is from UK

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 11:49 PM, mc100403119 Mohsin-U-Zaman <mc100403119@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

bro ur demand is much more ...charger image which u shown seems to be local
--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
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HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--

Regard,

Noman Shahid
Course: MBA
VU ID: mc090400043

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--
TAHIR ZAMAN SULEHRI

ASSOCIATE ENGINEER ELECTRONICS

Direct# XXXXXXXXXXXX

Land line #+XXXXXXXXXX

Email:tahirzamansulehri@gmail.com

This e-mail and any attachments are confidential and legally privileged, and are for the intended recipient only. If you are not the named recipient, please delete the mail and any attachments, and notify the sender immediately.
Do not access or disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information, as this is strictly prohibited.

For Chinese Only
塔希尔扎曼Sulehri
副工程师电子拉合尔巴基斯坦
移动＃： - XXXXXXXXXX
电子邮件：tahirzamansulehri@gmail.com

他的e - mail和任何附件的机密和法律的特权，只为预定的接收者。如果你不命名的收件人，请删除该邮件的任何附件，并立即通知发件人。
不要访问或任何其他人披露的内容，将其用于任何目的，或存储或复制的信息，因为这是严格禁止的。

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--

Regard,

Noman Shahid
Course: MBA
VU ID: mc090400043

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: لپ ٹاپ براۓفروخت Laptop For Urgent Sale, Rs.22500, Don't miss it!

please me the Model number of Lap Top

regards

tahir

On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 12:06 AM, mc090400043 Noman Shahid <mc090400043@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

Nothing is local the Socket shoe is local but charger including power cable is from UK

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 11:49 PM, mc100403119 Mohsin-U-Zaman <mc100403119@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

bro ur demand is much more ...charger image which u shown seems to be local
--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

--

Regard,

Noman Shahid
Course: MBA
VU ID: mc090400043

--
We say, "Be one as Pakistani Nation and grow up for Pakistan's Future". Wish you all the best. Join www.vuaskari.com,
To post to this group, send email to vuaskari_com@googlegroups.com
Visit these groups:
This (Main) Group:http://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_com?hl=en?hl=en
MIT/MCS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/vu_askarimit?hl=en?hl=en
HRM Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_hrm?hl=en?hl=en
Banking Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_banking?hl=en?hl=en
Management: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mgt?hl=en
Marketing: https://groups.google.com/group/vuaskari_mkt?hl=en
MIS Group: http://groups.google.com/group/askari_mis?hl=en

TAHIR ZAMAN SULEHRI

ASSOCIATE ENGINEER ELECTRONICS

Direct# XXXXXXXXXXXX

Land line #+XXXXXXXXXX

Email:tahirzamansulehri@gmail.com

This e-mail and any attachments are confidential and legally privileged, and are for the intended recipient only. If you are not the named recipient, please delete the mail and any attachments, and notify the sender immediately.
Do not access or disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information, as this is strictly prohibited.

For Chinese Only

塔希尔扎曼Sulehri
副工程师电子拉合尔巴基斯坦
移动＃： - XXXXXXXXXX
电子邮件：tahirzamansulehri@gmail.com

他的e - mail和任何附件的机密和法律的特权，只为预定的接收者。如果你不命名的收件人，请删除该邮件的任何附件，并立即通知发件人。
不要访问或任何其他人披露的内容，将其用于任何目的，或存储或复制的信息，因为这是严格禁止的。

Re: ::: vuaskari.com ::: لپ ٹاپ براۓفروخت Laptop For Urgent Sale, Rs.22500, Don't miss it!

Nothing is local the Socket shoe is local but charger including power cable is from UK

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 11:49 PM, mc100403119 Mohsin-U-Zaman <mc100403119@vu.edu.pk> wrote:

bro ur demand is much more ...charger image which u shown seems to be local
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